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 I call it justice to be served.

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Magna
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PostSubject: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 08:08

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I feel sad for the LMG nerfs but any nerf against HA is fine with me. A shotgun HA at least needs to get close to kill me and can't drop me dead like 40m away by popping up his shield and laughing in my face. Let's see how it will go to live.
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Seerus
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 08:35

Orion and battlejuice ads speed changed from 0.75 to 0.5 lol Very Happy. Take that career heavy assaults.
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Dopubalimatu
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 10:14

Gudgud.
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Seerus
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 11:23

Finally those vs mlg pros will find out that there are other lmgs to use and better yet other classes to play. One time I saw a dude with 300 directive points and beatlegeuse 96% playtime ha.
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Dopubalimatu
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 11:47

Ayy lmao

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Seerus
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 11:53

But I'm not career Smile
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Zeltenstrahler
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 12:27

(this is coming from a 'career' heavy - I have auraxed 6 lmgs on VS including bj and 3k+ kills on orion, and have +- 5000 lmg kills on TR and NC combined.)

I read the reddit thread this morning and it really looks like they're nerfing vanu, while keeping TR and NC where they are. Some people would even go as far as to say that they're indirectly buffing NC. While I agree with most of the changes they're about to make, such as buffs to EM1, Rhino and Polaris (and the butcher ofc) I definitely don't agree with the orion and bj changes proposed. People love to hate on those weapons and blame them for dying instead of thinking about their own playstyle. I don't know how many of you actually played the orion/bj but it's not some magical death stick. It's actually VERY similar to the msw, it just has more recoil and movement speed. Since I play all factions, I'm all for balance, so I feel like the movement multiplier should be lowered to .66 or .50, I don't care, but they should give something else in return (such as lower recoil/SPA).

I would also like to mention that by constantly whining about these weapons saying how they're OP you're only causing more people to flock over to an already overpopulated faction to try out this 'OP' weapon. It's kinda beneath BAWC to blame a weapon for dying imo, and saying it's 'justice to be served' for these 'mlg players'. Correct me if I'm wrong. Not calling out a specific BAWC member but I've heard this stuff from a couple people here now.
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flokiss1
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 12:36

I, i can't believe this. Are they actually doing this! Ohhhh my respect for those des is slowly being restored!
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The0ptimiz0r
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 12:50

Was about time, Is there a website to look which weapon you got droopped (killed) most?
I bet in my case it´s Prorion or Beetlejuice but I have to admit this is mainly caused to my offensive playstyle ;D
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Dr.Division
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 14:07

Yeah there is a app caled planetside archives
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FocusLight
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 14:35

Zelten, the primary issue here is not any stats on the Orion, SVA, BJ and NS15, it's the 0.75 mobility. I can't count the number of times I've died to VS HA's who manage to do the same old song and dance because they are blatantly faster than me. And that's all - a VS HA vs a TR HA for instance, happens all the time. If the VS HA has any of these guns, he has an advantage, and it's noticeable at that scale. The 0.75 mobility counters the mobility hit from popping your shield, it's that simple. The direct counter to HA shield is supposed to be less mobility. What then if not half, but a quarter of that is reduced? You notice.

I have, in comparison, not nearly as much of an issue with this when facing Nc, unless he has the NS15, and I can often TELL when I fight VS HA's who don't have any of these. The simply fact is, if that mobility is reduced to the level all other LMG's are on, this issue will stop existing and VS HA's will be brought to the level of the NC/TR versions.

The only issue I have with this change is that they won't touch the NS15m1 yet, at least they have not mentioned it once. This won't solve the issue, it will only reduce the severity of it. VS already use the NS15 the most of all 3 factions, I see no reason they won't just keep on keeping on with it.

As for the other proposed changes, the T16 might become a valuable weapon if it's changes go through. Beyond mobility etc. the only thing I'm wondering about is why tweak the stats of any of these weapons further? Some of the VS weapons don't seem to need the proposed reductions in stats as is proposed, as far as I see atl.

Whatever they do however, 0.75 has got to go, from ALL LMG's. It's directly countering a supposed down-side of using a faction ability. It's like having a Infil weapon that allows you to shoot while cloaked or a Medic AR that converts damage on the enemy into health and shields for you, it would directly conflicts with your supposed down-sides and break the class.


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Zeltenstrahler
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 15:03

FocusLight wrote:
Zelten, the primary issue here is not any stats on the Orion, SVA, BJ and NS15, it's the 0.75 mobility.

This is what everybody says. Yes, it might be slightly harder to hit somebody with .75 ads, but on the opposite side it's harder for them to hit you. Also, with their shield activated, they really can't move all that fast; heavy shields effectively counter the movement buff for the most part. I personally have never had trouble dealing with VS heavies as TR or NC. In fact, since many wannabes come over to VS to try the orion and stuff (but then realize it's harder to use than they thought) it makes it much easier to kill vanu. For that reason I think I have more VS kills on both my TR and my NC.

Regardless, I do agree (as I've said before), the .75 does give an edge to good players who can use it to their advantage. It should be nerfed, but not to the extent that is proposed. Removing the .75 ads is fine by me, but that would turn it into a worse msw-r, which is already worse than the orion in it's current state or the anchor. The 'fair' option imo would be to turn it into a msw-r like gun, with SPA, less recoil and better moving CoF.

Also, come on, the NS-15 can't be bothering you that much.. Its damage model can't keep up with other CQC lmgs.

EDIT: It feels to me many people are blaming .75 ads for dying when really the other player is better than them, with or without .75 ads. I get killed a lot by better players, but meh. I really like this discussion though, keep it coming
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FocusLight
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 15:50

Regarding the point that Orion should have SPA, I have argued this on the main forums. Indeed, I've argued that the Orion should get SPA and ALS both, and be the purchasable VS CQB-LMG while VS get a more proper 'all-purpose' replacement as a standard weapon. Same for NC and th Gauss SAW tbh.

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We are in agreement on pretty much anything bar how much of an impact 0.75 movement has on HA shields and what should be done.

Also, I agree that the NS15 is far from as 'bad' in this case as the Orion/SVA is in CQB, but it's still a 0.75 mobility LMG. It would only be fair that they just don't nerf VS' available 0.75 LMG's down to a universal level of only one LMG that has it, ever, I'd be more happy with NO LMG having it. Simply because now most of the hardened 0.75 LMG users will switch to the NS15 and never touch another LMG ever again.

Might as well go all the way if you firs start altering a concept like this, imo.


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Dopubalimatu
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 16:52

I'm for the 0.75 ADS removal. If the 0.75 ADS isn't all that important why bother bitching about it. Let it go through and be on par with other faction ADS modifier. ADAD ADS is the HA meta and being harder to hit is major difference. Besides, I'd hardly say MSW-R is gonna be better/on the level with Orion or SVA as it's diagonal recoil is way harder to control than either VS LMGs. Even after the nerf I think Orion and SVA are gonna be better close-mid range LMGs than MSW. Giving it something in exchange of 0.75 ADs removal would kind of defeat the purpose of its nerf. You can't honestly claim balance when VS is the only faction that has 2 faction-specific LMGs that both have 0.75 ADS. There's a damn good reason why VS HA is such a phenomenon and I do agree that there is hype that causes its popularity but that is hardly the only reason HA is so popular on VS.

For stats purposes over 100 VS players have over 10k kills on Orion alone, 85 on Betelgeuse. On MSW only about 30 players have over 10k kills, on Anchor it's 60. There's a reason why most of the infantry farmfits are VS across servers. VS win 43% out of all the alerts. If you want to claim balance and point out the misperception fine. What this patch does is shift the perception so maybe less people flock to VS to play HA and will play on their original faction or other classes.

Besides they are putting all the changes on TEST and who knows maybe nothing gets nerfed so it doesn't even fucking matter.


Last edited by Dopubalimatu on Fri 29 May 2015, 17:12; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:01

On my skill level, I never have problem with HA. Their shield makes them more easy to see.
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Seerus
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:05

You should play on potato settings. You'll see them through walls.
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Dr.Division
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:12

there are no potato Settings anymore!!
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Zeltenstrahler
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:16

Good points dopu. I disagree on the recoil handling though, imo the msw-r is much easier to control, but let's call that subjective. Fact is still though, msw has SPA and a better cone of fire. This makes it better for both close and mid (long?) range combat. There definitely has to be compensation for that (I'm assuming the .75 nerf).

Regarding stats, you're right, farmfits are mostly on VS, because many farmers like the orion/bj (especially bj of course). It's really not too strange that VS has the most 10k+ kill players then. That's why we're nerfing. Now yes we need to shift that perception, but not go for the striker treatment (though it's not THAT bad of course). If they're going to nerf it, they need to do it right.

BTW Focus, the ALS is irrelevant since I don't think people really care about hipfiring lmgs.
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Dopubalimatu
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:18

284 wrote:
On my skill level, I never have problem with HA. Their shield makes them more easy to see.

Ayy lmao. Our lord and prophet Renzor says you can't do shit against HAs
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Also MSW-R is 143 dmg weapon which means that SPA doesn't decrease the number of bullets needed for kill. I say it's good they put it on TEST. If the did overnerf(which I doublt) them they will decrease the nerf level and it will be fine I figure.


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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:20

You didn't know Doperdd? Shooting the knees is the new headshot. DBG '2015.
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Zeltenstrahler
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:27

Yeah that's true, but that's when you're looking at headshots only. I'll bet 10 euros you use SPA, because it definitely can give you a small edge in bodyshots, especially against resist shielders afaik.
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Dopubalimatu
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:31

Zeltenstrahler wrote:
Yeah that's true, but that's when you're looking at headshots only. I'll bet 10 euros you use SPA, because it definitely can give you a small edge in bodyshots, especially against resist shielders afaik.

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Zeltenstrahler
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:37

I heard NC are giving out bonus cheques?
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 17:50

Dopubalimatu wrote:
When am I getting my money? [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

In which game? whahahaha pig
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Dopubalimatu
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PostSubject: Re: I call it justice to be served.   Fri 29 May 2015, 18:02

284 wrote:


In which game? whahahaha pig

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